Suggestion when recording a cabinet

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surfnorthwest
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Suggestion when recording a cabinet

Postby surfnorthwest » 24 Oct 2008, 07:22

After literally two years of experimenting with different mics and the correct way to record a loud full blown cabinet I finally have it figured out. Thought I would share my ideas with you guys to save you some time and perhaps some frustration and money. Of course this is what sounds best to my ears in reproducing the true tone.

Mics - I use both a Dynamic and Condenser, after trying and buying literally over 15 recommended microphones I have narrowed it down to what works best. When I say that I mean the combination that gives me the true tone and dynamics of your amp when recorded.

For those of you with cash simply use a Royer R-121, this mic by itself will capture your amps true sound at a high volume and setup is easy. However this mic is $1300.00. For those not willing to spend that read on...

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If you want to be a bit thriftier the combination I found that captures the amps true tone consists of using different microphones, the dynamic Shure SM-57, and the condenser AKG Perception 400. The Shure can be had for under $100 and the AKG can be found for around $225. However this combination recorded on two seprate tracks will play back like you are in the room.

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Setup - First we will setup the Shure 57. You are going to want to turn up your mixer or preamp that the mic is plugged into to so you can easily hear the hum of the amp through the headphones. Then use the headphones to listen to the amps speaker while you move the 57 around trying to find the sweet spot. The 57 should be almost on the center cone but a bit offset and about 3 inches from the grill at a 45 degree angle. With the headphones on move around the mic until you hear the cleanest sound from the speaker. You are only hearing the hum of the amp but you will be able to tell the difference in tone, move it until you hear the hum very clear, not muddy.

Next we will setup the AKG. Turn the level all the way down or off on the 57 and bring the AKG up until you clearly hear the amps hum in your headphones. Since this is a condenser mic you will have had to of supplied it with phantom power. Move this mic to another speaker in the cab and set it back about 30 inches to start. Begin the same process as with the 57 in moving the mic around until you hear the clearest tone from your amp. Once you have it positioned turn up the gain on the 57 so that you can hear both mics together in the headphones.

Here is the first problem you will need to solve, phase. The microphones will be out of phase and the hum you hear will sound as if you engaged a phase shifter. Here is how we will correct this.

Without moving the 57 out of its final position move the AKG mic a bit forward or back until you clearly hear the phase stop, you are now in phase.

The last step will be to slightly tilt the AKG mic so that it is setting at around 30 degrees and not vertical. Once you have done this and you can clearly hear both mics without the phase sound you have the mics set for optimum performance.

Recording - Next when begin recording in your DAW set each microphone on its own track. Turn up your amp to the loudest you will have it when you record it. Next set the faders so they are equal but not bouncing up in the red or clipping. Record your tracks with your guitar.

Mixing - In your DAW pan the first track to left 50%, and then the second track right to 50%. Adjust your faders to optimum volume and you got it.

What you will find with this set up is a very clean accurate duplication of the amps tone. It really is the best I have found in the two years of figuring out how to get it perfect.

I hope this helps some of you who have not been satisfied with your recordings and mics. Below is a pic of my setup

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Postby Spotted Dog » 21 Nov 2008, 23:55

Thanks this helps a lot. I've tried with a pair of 57s moving them around here and there running through a presonus fire pod. Not the result I was hoping for. I'll have to try the second mic and the headphone idea... duh.
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Postby steep » 03 Jan 2009, 08:57

Sound really interesting...
I'm picking up my 2466 head first thing monday morning, and can´t wait to try this. HOOO HOOOOOO!
I have the 57, but will also try other dynamics like the ATM-650 (Audio Technica) or the Raven (Electro-Voice), and a condenser AT-4050 (Audio Technica) and will definately try the "headphones-trick"
Another tip is also to do the ATM-2500 (Audio Technica) dead center of the speaker.
This is both a dynamic and condenser mic in one microphone, and will take away all the phase problems.
I know Metallica uses this in all their live concerts. But they do NOT use the VM though... HEHE!

Thanks a bunch for the tip, surfnorthwest!!!!

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Postby DeanM » 03 Jan 2009, 18:33

what i wanna know is how did ya remember all that!! if it was me, after id done all the dif setups and i knew which recording soundest best, id be like....crap i never wrote it down or anything!! which set up did i use!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

anyway....if you had the time it would be cool to here sample recordings of the steps youv listed! :) this info will also surely save some people alot of time and hardship starting off in their own studios!!

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Postby surfnorthwest » 03 Jan 2009, 19:24

what i wanna know is how did ya remember all that!!
I don't know, probably the same way I remember what I told my wife that last guitar cost me. If it is important you will remember it

You know recording cabinets is such a art I am always finding new studio tricks. I will tell you how I do it today as the article above is how I was doing it over a year ago. And while the method above still yeilds great results I have found more interesting ways to capture guitar cabinet.

I use a Royer 121 and a shure SM57 to capture the cabinet

The Royer is setup dead center on the cabinet at a 45 degree angle about 3 feet back from the cabinet, keep in mind that the Royer is a ribbon mic. I then set up the shure SM57 up against the grill in the "sweet spot" as described above.

I then record each mic on its own track.

Then I pan the Royer track left 68% and leave the 57 in the center of the mix. I then add a widening or a doubling effect (VST) to the center track, the result is a perfect live stereo sound.

So you see while there is a art to getting the sound into the computer there also is a art when eq'ing and mastering the mix to make it sound to the listener that they are in the room.
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