Replacing Lego Block Signal Caps Vintage Modern

[TonyC]

What I remember most about the Legos is in a small room at bedroom levels I kept hearing this "tinky" treble type attack when I picked the strings. It would drive me insane. Then the mids and upper mids seemed like they were underneath the tinky sound and were not all that complex.

I know exactly what you mean when saying "tinky" treble, very well described. Luckily I never play at bedroom levels. The tone is much fuller when the master is up high. I would like more complexity though, I know what you mean by that too i think. To me it means I want less "flute" and more "English horn".

And about the 16 cap tone pot, I'll pass. I'm very happy with my good old Russian NOS PIO cap :love

[frank9310]

haha Funny about the 16 pos. cap. Too complicated for me too. I like to set it and forget it on tone and just mess with the volume control.

You're right about the master volume being dimed, the "tinky" seems to get absorbed in a larger room or gig with drums etc but is annoying as hell at home even at lower volumes, not to mention just an overall cloudiness over the tone in general. I was blown away after putting the orange drops in and hearing a myriad of brilliant tones that weren't there 20 minutes earlier and it made an even bigger difference gigging at full volume.

[StephenRutledge]

These types of modifications, I suspect, are so minor the average punter would probably not hear the difference. For us guitar nuts it may or may not make the world of difference.
There are so many variables starting with our hands and ending with the speakers that it's hard to suggest any one modification that would make a significant impact on the final tone.

Having said that I'm curious as hell and would love to hear back from anyone that has done any of these types of mods.

Ahh the pursuit of tonal nirvana! :rocker

[Bluesburst]

I was speaking to an electronics hobbyist friend (non-musician) of mine explaining what I want to do with the capacitors and he suggested putting in some sort of special socket so I can plug in different caps to experiment with.

He said to spend the extra and get quality sockets but it would be worth it and give the opportunity to mess around with different combinations. I like the idea, anyone had any experience with these in amps?

[DeanM]

those sockets are used alot in pedals. people like to take out the original IC's and put in a socket so they can try out different ICs.you could do it with the capacitors suppose but id rather solder em in. maybe if ya did it temporarily to find out what sounds best n then solder em in?

[frank9310]

StephenRutledge: Not true. Replacing signal caps provides about the most dramatic shift in tone quality of all mods. If you go on the Metro Amp forum or any of the amp builder forums and ask around about how to improve tone on a PCB style amp, the first 2 things they'll suggest to change is the signal capacitors and to upgrade the output transformer (not the power transformer). Those are the main 2 things that will change-improve or worsen your tone. Fortunately, from what I've heard, most output transformers available by places like Marstran, Metro, Mercury, Heyboer are an improvement over the cheaper made production model transformers and about signal caps, that's already been covered.

Bluesburst-DeanM: I did think of that because it would be nice to be able to change a few different typed before damaging the trace lines but I've never heard of a socket for caps but would be nice. I even thought about puttng a switch between a couple different types in tandem. THen you could just flick a dip switch between each one to voice it how you like with a combination of maybe Sozo and orange drops, or orange drops and Mallory 150s, etc.

[TonyC]

These types of modifications, I suspect, are so minor the average punter would probably not hear the difference. For us guitar nuts it may or may not make the world of difference.
There are so many variables starting with our hands and ending with the speakers that it's hard to suggest any one modification that would make a significant impact on the final tone.

It may be that the average listener don't notice all the nuances as we do. For me it's a two way communication, the response I get get from the instrument/amp has a great impact on how I play, and how much I enjoy it. Even the smallest things counts. Heck, I hear harmonic differences by adjusting the truss rod even the tiniest bit or by adjusting the height of the saddles as little as it is possible. Not to adjust the playability, too small changes for that, but for the tone.

I'm a tone whore!

[frank9310]

Hey Tony,

Check out these kittens I just recently raised. The one looks just like your avatar! http://areyouexperienced.net/kittens031009.htm

She was the funniest and my favorite out of the bunch.

[TonyC]

Very cute!

I love cats too. I grew up with cats and never wanna be without them. The cat in my avatar is 7 years old today, but I took the pic when she was around 10 weeks.

[StephenRutledge]

I'm a tone whore too... as I said... I'm curious as hell and would love to hear back from anyone that has done any of these mods (on a VM).

[frank9310]

Very cute!

I love cats too. I grew up with cats and never wanna be without them. The cat in my avatar is 7 years old today, but I took the pic when she was around 10 weeks.

Awww. Yeah I have 5 cats and a dog. So I guess you could say I'm a tone animal!

[slowpokerhino]

I'm a tone whore too... as I said... I'm curious as hell and would love to hear back from anyone that has done any of these mods (on a VM).

Me too!

[TonyC]

I'm a tone whore too... as I said... I'm curious as hell and would love to hear back from anyone that has done any of these mods (on a VM).

I didn't mean to say you didn't care about tone. I apologize if it seemed that way.

And I'm as curious as you are

[MKB]

You have my curiosity up as well. I have used Sozos in my other gigging amp (a 1987 clone) and found them to be great sounding; they are able to make a brightly voiced amp sound lively but cut off the harshness. They were MUCH better than Orange Drops or standard polyester caps in making this amp sound like a Marshall (I used both and was unhappy with them, the Sozos made a wonderful difference).

However, the Vintage Modern already has the Marshall tone, and doesn't sound like it needs any cap mods to me. It is not too bright or harsh at all, in fact it has an interesting voicing in the mids all its own (in HDR) unique to itself that I would not want to change. With the great care Steve put into the voicing of this amp, I would be concerned that swapping out the caps for another type might make the amp sound worse. I'd be hesitant to put Sozos in a VM as they tend to be a bit on the mellow side, and might darken the VM too much.

You can make large tonal changes and even improvements using NOS preamp tubes, I've been pleased using bright tubes like RCA 7025's in various locations.

[TonyC]

However, the Vintage Modern already has the Marshall tone, and doesn't sound like it needs any cap mods to me. It is not too bright or harsh at all, in fact it has an interesting voicing in the mids all its own (in HDR) unique to itself that I would not want to change. With the great care Steve put into the voicing of this amp, I would be concerned that swapping out the caps for another type might make the amp sound worse.

True, the VM has a very unique tone and voicing. I recognize it every time I hear one. Steve did a fantastic job creating this amp, it's nearly perfect in my opinion. But we all have all our little things we like and want to reach. One thing for me was leaving the stock preamp tubes (chosen by Steve of course) in favor for others to get a mid character more suited to my taste. Changing the caps might be another thing I'd like.

We'll never know if we don't try.