Tone Approach. Helix, Kemper, etc

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Cousin Muely
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Tone Approach. Helix, Kemper, etc

Postby Cousin Muely » 12 Apr 2017, 16:18

What do you guys do when getting the tones you want on a modeler. Obviously with a physical amplifier i'd set it up by ear and then attempt to translate that tone through the mic and whatever else down the line. A modeled guitar sound, you're at the mercy of the entire chain with no way to ear check the source. On the Helix i seem to approach this in different ways and i'm curious how others go through this process. Twist knobs until it sounds good Yes but any Go To Methods?

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Re: Tone Approach. Helix, Kemper, etc

Postby Alpeggio » 13 Apr 2017, 02:01

Good question,
You know I always use a mixer, whether miking a real amp or going from a Helix to PC.

The reason for this is it gives me that final analog EQ adjustment and Lexicon reverb if needed.
So I'm looking at the Helix with it's modeled mic and position as one from my monitors.
If I want the effect of moving the mic or adding depth, I can simulate that with Mixer EQ and Reverb.

Despite the fact that it uses more analog/digital converters this way, as opposed to using the Helix as the sound card for direct pc recording, my experiments have shown it to sound superior.
Analog eq is still better than digital, just like the zoom on a camera.
Hope that helps T.
The best tones from modelers is when going through a PA or similar.
This introduces a mixer and real speakers, giving a real room reverb and depth where ever they are being played.
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Re: Tone Approach. Helix, Kemper, etc

Postby Cousin Muely » 13 Apr 2017, 04:16

Yeah. You have gotten great results doing it that way. I'm not beyond doing it like that but I want to explore the USB method fully before I completely revamp to that.

I have been doing a lot of reading on Helix forums regarding mic placement and combining them. I believe one of the things that hinders me is a lack of studio experience with these mic models. I've done way more live close miking with 57s and
Sennheisers than anything. Understanding from experience of using the real thing would seem to give a better baseline in how to achieve results. Like say an R121. Experience may tell you that mic works best backed off from the cabinet for example. SM57 needs to be close, etc.

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Re: Tone Approach. Helix, Kemper, etc

Postby Alpeggio » 13 Apr 2017, 06:05

The modeling on the Helix is good, so yeah stick with what you know works, and it will work on the Helix.

But if you have no experience of Ribon mics, then you can only experiment.
A general rule is to have one Ribon and one Dynamic.
Ribon for bass and Dynamic for a nice round top end.

So a 121 and a 57. This always gives a good tone on a Marshall Plexi type.
You still get these options when you move to IRs.
I find IRs more detailed and real sounding.
Ownhammer are generally warmer and more coloured, while CabIR.eu are more real, still with mic options.
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Re: Tone Approach. Helix, Kemper, etc

Postby Cousin Muely » 13 Apr 2017, 06:41

That's the kind of things i've missed out on in the real world Al. I have been using that combination though. I experimented last night with a 57 close up on a 1x12 for a focused tone but a 121 on a 4x12 backed off with more reflection for more body. Blend the 2 from an ABY after the amp but before the cabs.

I've noticed up till now I've tended to gravitate to a big stereo field/studio like tone because of the fun in having a monster sound like that. But, that doesn't necessarily equate to getting down to really dialing in an amp tone that is specific. I've recently made it a point to stay away from that mindset. I have also gone to using a mono eq block as my last effect after the cab(s) to keep the tone more focused instead of defaulting to a stereo spread.

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Re: Tone Approach. Helix, Kemper, etc

Postby Alpeggio » 13 Apr 2017, 11:05

Cool experiments, and yeah mono is good when building up a track, and pan them left and right.

I like to keep things simple like an ac/dc mix.
It lets the good tones come through.
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