I got my AFd and not really impressed

[Slashwannabe1]

I think you dont understand what i mean and i blame my english sorry.

SO, for you to understand, if one day you have the chance to play an AFD side by side with a JCM, a Vintage, a plexi or any old marshall, you will instantanely understand ;) i will record both amp this week


And second, that AFD sound exactly like the Quickrod, dont spend 2000 when you coudl have a quickrod for less and with a clean channel..

Who needs to try them side by side? we know what we're getting with the AFD100. The meat in the sound comes from other gear in your rig, Adjust your guitars, try different cabs, we as guitarists don't always hit a home run with gear on the first try. One piece of great gear doesn't mean great tone instantly you need to get other great gear & then adjust that great gear correctly. Just because one cab sounds good on one amp doesn't mean its going to sound good on every amp.

That sonic character that I desire in the AFD I've heard in all the videos I've seen- amateur & professional, I don't have to try the amp we know what it will get, and if it DOESN'T get that tone when we have it in our hands its obviously got to be something else in your rig not producing that sound. You bought the AFD100 for the Slash tone why expect anything else out of it? its a modded JCM 800 circut why expect it to be a regular JCM 800?.

The Quickrod I've tried and its nowhere near the AFD tone...maybe with your gear its closer? but Guitars are not a one size fits all, you need to get the right cabs & pickups to compliment that amp & unless you're using something similar to the Alnico 2 pickups I wouldn't judge the amp. The #34 is a slightly thinner tone, but with the right set up guitar you can fatten that up, the AFD tone is fatter than the #34. Maybe you should have just bought a JCM 800 instead if thats the tone you're looking for.

I guess the biggest question is....what tone are you after? if you're into Slash's tone you'll just have to get used to the fact its brighter than it appears on record vs real life. I think you have to train your ears to his tone if thats what you desire, once I heard Slash live I was convinced absolutly 100% that I needed a Marshall Jubilee,JCM 800 (later on the Vintage Modern). Still to this day theres still new nuances I hear in his tone that I hear & try to hit with my Vintage Modern & knowing what makes those nuances helps you achieve that tone better.

I wish you the best of luck man, but I think often times you're too quick to judge your gear....play with the amp for a month extensivly & do some recordings you'll find its mojo. I wish you lived near me because I would come over & help you dial that amp in.

[Hellhound]

Here are a couple of things you could try. Stick a reverb and delay in the loop. Run the power on the full 100 watts - a 6 watt VM would sound very different than our VM's. Get a thumping bass line going behind it! This amp just floats on the bass, man! Neck pickup, #34 mode add the effects and there's your flutey Slash Lead tone. It covers a shed load of old classic rock as well. Try jamming along with some old tracks and you'll see what I mean.

It's not your amp, mine is the same. Perhaps it's just a question of taste? Sell it to Slashwannabe, he'll love it

[fortress]

Slashwannabe,, did you actually one AFD?? you dont know what it is... You love your VIntage modern and i assure you that if you had both amp in a room to try it out , you will keep the Vintage

Dont tell me to check my guitar or whatever... A mesa sound like a MEsa and Marshall sound like a marshall even if you have a crap guitar.. That AFd is a modern sounding amp.. The JVM is a modern sounding amp and don't tell me this amp (the JVM) sound as good as the Vintage modern or a JCM 800

Anyway, the more i listened to the video of the AFD amp, the more i knew it was to sound thin like the Quickrod but my pre order was already deposit and i wanted to try it to 100% sure


I never say that this amp doenst sound good, just that the amp doesnt get the ooommppph and the Big FAt tone of the old one

[Slashwannabe1]

Dont tell me to check my guitar or whatever... A mesa sound like a MEsa and Marshall sound like a marshall even if you have a crap guitar.. That AFd is a modern sounding amp.. The JVM is a modern sounding amp and don't tell me this amp (the JVM) sound as good as the Vintage modern or a JCM 800

Yeah you get that Marshall tone no matter what, I swear to you its better adjusting your pickups.

Please do me one big favor....I beg you actually, try your pickup height like this:

Bridge Pick up- 1/8th inch on both E strings

Neck- 7/32 inch on both e strings

measure with highest fret pressed down on your guitar

My sound got fatter using that method along with more sustain because the magnets were low enough on the neck pickup allowing more string vibration & fatter sound. Its worked on every guitar I tried it on regardless of pickup configuration. Its nearly perfect with this setup I promise you. It will fill in the gaps in the thinner tone, several people have already tried this height on the AFD that I've talked to on youtube & here and they say its made all the difference to the thinner tone!. In fact on my VM its so fat sounding with this pickup configuration that I turned my Detail on 10 & Body on 0, and its killer!.

You didn't believe me about the speaker cab with G12T75s making the VM sound like it had less gain either until you tried another cab lol. Trust me these settings will be insane if you try.

I do agree with you, I love MY VM!, I appreciate what each amp does, the JCM Slash,800 & AFD.

I have faith you'll get it fatter sounding.

I have NOT tried the AFD100, but I have tried a #34 modded JCM 800 with 65/50s recently and the circut is identical to Santiagos design of the #34 AFD Circut that he revealed a few weeks back, truley an experience all I will say about trying that amp.

[fortress]

Hi Slash, adjusting my pickup would not give the fat tone i'm talking about. Its not a matter of that


I'll record something tonight of both amp and maybe you will have a better idea of what i'm talking about., I'm not sure my use of word is right to say what i want

Even my rythm guitarist got the same reaction when he did hear the 2 amps.. Remember, he know nothing really amp wise (i mean, old marshall vs new marshall etc),

He instantanely got the same reaction has me when he heard the VIntage modern after the AFD. Liked the VM more because of the oooommmmph and the bigger sound

[Mats A]

...More in the plexi style with EL34´s than the VM ...

Pretty obvious as the Vintage Modern is in the Plexi style with KT66s (JTM).

Yes and that is what makes the VM so great!

-- Tue May 03, 2011 11:00 am --

What do you mean with beefy then? Is it like that you can feel the sound in your body. Like the hair on your arms rises. I can feel the sound from my AFD just as much as my VM no problem even in #34 mode. What speaker do you use? Please do a recording it will be great to hear.

[Slashwannabe1]

Hi Slash, adjusting my pickup would not give the fat tone i'm talking about. Its not a matter of that

Sometimes I wonder if you're a lost cause. Man I like you like a brother but sheesh try the settings out, don't be foolish, theres no way it won't work, its gotten every guitar I've tried it on no matter the pickup type FATTER sounding (half of the Slash sound/feel is in those settings), at least if you try these settings I can better help you & steer you in the right direction for what to do. If its THAT thin after adjusting the pickups maybe you've got some power tubes going out (new ones can ship dead on arrival) or your cab is suspect, which brings me to what cab & speaker combo are you using?.

The only reason I'm so passionate about this is because I know all of the amps you've been through & we're on the same level for tone we want to achieve, I know sooner or later we'll track down what the problem is.

I know you think an amp should be able to sound good regardless of pickup height but this is the real world where the difference between mediocre tone & great tone litterally is a few screw driver turns on your guitar. This is professional grade gear you have, it will acurately produce the sound it picks up from your guitar, meaning guitars quality,pickups,set up & what its made out of actually matter in the final tone you'll produce, its not like a Mesa amp which will pre amp its way into a tone that covers all of these aspects up & produce a generic tone. What this means? set up your guitar to match the amp .

[Steven Latch]

Slash,

Let me tell you something. For years and years, I have had the habit of sticking my pickup as close a possible to the strings. Comes from my tennage days where having the HIGHEST OUTPUT meant having the best tone.

But I get what you're saying in terms of lost tone and sustain. So.... believe me, I will definitely give it a try. So your words are not lost hahaha!

To come back to the AFD, I find it extremely guitar and pickup sensitive. Strat with an SH-4 in regular tuning = not really fat tone. ESP Lynch with duncan custom tuned half a step done = Very fat tone.

[kissfanps]

Iv'e been watching this thread to see what develops before I chimed in. I don't have my AFD yet (should be this week or next), but I understand what fortress is saying. I have watched many videos and some have that fat sound and some do not. And when I say fat, I think of engaging the midboost on the VM - those lower creamy mids.
For example,

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/user/marktestroo ... 8D1lKIEYdM[/youtube]

To me, this sounds like the JCM has a lot more of the fat sound, albiet a more modern sound. The AFD sounds much more vintage in this clip. (why am i having problems with posting youtube videos lately?)

However,

[youtube][/youtube]

As you can hear, that handwired cab makes the AFD sound FAT. I can't really comment on the V30s because mic was so off axis to get a good reference.

And of course, our own gear whore:

[youtube][/youtube]

This is probably the best example of what the AFD can do because you can actually hear what its like in the mix. And it sounds fantastic.

So, what cabinet are you using fortress? Maybe a speaker change can help out. When I tried my VM through a regular 1960 cab, it sound like utter crap. All that fat creamy goodness was gone. I also wouldn't go blaming the guitar or the pickups as you are able to achieve fatness with other amps.

And I do have to say that slash's tone does not come close to my definition of fat.

[Slashwannabe1]

Slash,

Let me tell you something. For years and years, I have had the habit of sticking my pickup as close a possible to the strings. Comes from my tennage days where having the HIGHEST OUTPUT meant having the best tone.

But I get what you're saying in terms of lost tone and sustain. So.... believe me, I will definitely give it a try. So your words are not lost hahaha!

To come back to the AFD, I find it extremely guitar and pickup sensitive. Strat with an SH-4 in regular tuning = not really fat tone. ESP Lynch with duncan custom tuned half a step done = Very fat tone.

Hahaha thanks man. Yeah I was guilty of that too! I used to set them really high for output...but I've been toying around with pickup settings in the last two months after playing my buddies stock Eppi SG & noticing how juicy the tone was even with stock pick ups so I decided since I had Seymour Duncans and they should sound at least as good? so looked up various pickup heights and I ran across how Slash actually sets his up which was way lower than I had mine for the last 6-7 years and I was in awe of the tone & response & sustain as well as perceived "More Gain" which is probably due to the more sustain factor.

I've been beating on this drum since I discovered what a massive difference in tone & playability it makes. It even made my guitar sound better unplugged with the magnets not ruining the sustain.

It actually removed a pedal off the floor for me as well...I no longer use the Ge-7 to boost for harder metal tones, just dime the detail & push the mid boost in.

-- Tue May 03, 2011 10:35 pm --

And I do have to say that slash's tone does not come close to my definition of fat.

Its a great mid range crunch. When I seen him live it was a pretty bright clear distorted tone. I agree I wouldn't call it fat either, though sometimes its a heavy tone depending on his approach, back in the Use Your Illusions Tour days I'd consider that a fat tone.

I also wouldn't go blaming the guitar or the pickups as you are able to achieve fatness with other amps.

That doesn't mean a whole lot to be honest as you can adjust the fatness & mix between treble & bass tones by adjusting your pickups very easily & when the magnets from the neck pickup are further from the strings you get more vibration & sustain meaning FATTER TONE. Honestly of all the things one can do to their guitar rig, why not try the FREE & EASIEST THING TO DO? ADJUSTING THE PICKUPS!!!!!!! Then see if it helps, all I'm getting at.

The AFD100 does not nessisarily have a thinner tone but it has a very tunable nice midrange crunch to it that lets the users Real Guitar sound stand on its own. There is a reason why some guitarists go through many guitars trying to find a good recording tone. Not every Les Paul or Strat is created equal or with the same wood as eachother. The best way to compensate for this is adjusting the pickups.

The VM is a naturally able to be a "fatter" amp as are almost all amps made, the AFD is thinner than average but it can get fat with the right supporting cast of gear & settings. This being a known thing try different cabs & settings/pickups. Thats the story.

If you're after the Slash tone then you don't need to try shit...adjust the pickups like the settings of Slash's I listed, Buy his pickups, for the Live tone use V30s or for his recorded tone use a 100watt Greenback 4x12 and thats it JAM!.

[fortress]

Hi Slash, adjusting my pickup would not give the fat tone i'm talking about. Its not a matter of that

Sometimes I wonder if you're a lost cause. Man I like you like a brother but sheesh try the settings out, don't be foolish, theres no way it won't work, its gotten every guitar I've tried it on no matter the pickup type FATTER sounding (half of the Slash sound/feel is in those settings), at least if you try these settings I can better help you & steer you in the right direction for what to do. If its THAT thin after adjusting the pickups maybe you've got some power tubes going out (new ones can ship dead on arrival) or your cab is suspect, which brings me to what cab & speaker combo are you using?.

The only reason I'm so passionate about this is because I know all of the amps you've been through & we're on the same level for tone we want to achieve, I know sooner or later we'll track down what the problem is.

I know you think an amp should be able to sound good regardless of pickup height but this is the real world where the difference between mediocre tone & great tone litterally is a few screw driver turns on your guitar. This is professional grade gear you have, it will acurately produce the sound it picks up from your guitar, meaning guitars quality,pickups,set up & what its made out of actually matter in the final tone you'll produce, its not like a Mesa amp which will pre amp its way into a tone that covers all of these aspects up & produce a generic tone. What this means? set up your guitar to match the amp .

Slash, my dear Slash, you just don't understand what i'm talking about and i dont blame you. My english is not 100% and i probably dont explain my point like i could in french.


you already did hear my Splawn Quickrod clips. The afd is really close in tone.. So, remember the QUickrod and now, tell me again that its as FAT as a Vintage modern, jcm 800 plexi etc etc...

Its probably that the AFD got alot of treble that remove the fat tone of it..


What i mean when talking about thin sound is exactly what happen when you kick in a wahwah .. it remove the fatness and add treble to your sound when the pedal is full up..

I dont understand why poeple dont see my point. Especially people who did play with both the AFD and old marshall..

Again, i didnt say it sound bad, just that it isnt a FAT jcm on steroid.. more modern sounding to me and thin.

-- Wed May 04, 2011 9:16 am --

I'm using greenback speaker

Tried the amp on my friend V30 cab but i prefer the greenback

[Sully]

Hi Slash, adjusting my pickup would not give the fat tone i'm talking about. Its not a matter of that

I dont understand why poeple dont see my point. Especially people who did play with both the AFD and old marshall..

For what its worth I see your point and agree. Its not a fat, full amp. Its just not. Maybe if its dimed it'll get some body to it. Who knows.

[fortress]

Hi Slash, adjusting my pickup would not give the fat tone i'm talking about. Its not a matter of that

I dont understand why poeple dont see my point. Especially people who did play with both the AFD and old marshall..

For what its worth I see your point and agree. Its not a fat, full amp. Its just not. Maybe if its dimed it'll get some body to it. Who knows.

Im playing in a band, its dimmed ;) Its just another kind of amp, a different animal..

[Slashwannabe1]

you already did hear my Splawn Quickrod clips. The afd is really close in tone.. So, remember the QUickrod and now, tell me again that its as FAT as a Vintage modern, jcm 800 plexi etc etc...

Its probably that the AFD got alot of treble that remove the fat tone of it..


What i mean when talking about thin sound is exactly what happen when you kick in a wahwah .. it remove the fatness and add treble to your sound when the pedal is full up..

I dont understand why poeple dont see my point. Especially people who did play with both the AFD and old marshall..

Again, i didnt say it sound bad, just that it isnt a FAT jcm on steroid.. more modern sounding to me and thin.

-- Wed May 04, 2011 9:16 am --

I'm using greenback speaker

Tried the amp on my friend V30 cab but i prefer the greenback

Yeah the cocked Wah type sound! a input ground is what makes the AFD100s #34 sound like that Kevin told me. Its that cocked wah sound without as much noise as cocking a real wah. I do understand its a more mid range tone in #34 mode, and as I said before adjusting the pickups could help fatten it up (worth a shot to see) but yes stock the AFD is a thinner amp like you said with the wah sound.

I agree the 100w Greenback 4x12 might be the best option with the AFD100.

Is this just in AFD mode you notice this? or only in #34? or both?

What tone are you trying to capture exactly? I'm thinking you could get the tone you're describing a bit easier with a 2466 VM. Did you listen to my clips yet of it trying to sound like the #34? Its basically got everything but the slight cocked wah effect.

[fortress]

Hey Slash, maybe i'll sold the AFD so, if you are interested ;)


didnt have the time to record some clips

I listened to your AFD tone with the Vintage and i like it better ;)


anyway, its a subjective thing ;)

-- Fri May 06, 2011 9:49 am --

Slash, its both 34 and aFD mode

AFD mode add bass to the sound but its not what i'm reffering as FAT Tone


I wish we could be together in the same room with the 2 amps and discussing this and playing both amp ;)


When i'm talking about FAT tone, the picture i can give to you is that when playing a HIGH e string on JCM 800, its like you have a 13 gauges strings and when playing it with an AFD Quickrod amp, is like you have a 9 gauges strings..

dont know if you understand what i mean but its the best pictures i can give to you ;) I'm not just sure if FAT tone is the right word to use to describe what i'm talking about. My poor english sorry