100 watt VM on 40 watt cab.....

[guitarguru]

I know it's tricky, but I just ended up, after selling and buying things, with a G12M20 2x12 cabinet and my 2466 head. I use it now on the Low Dynamic Range with both preamp volumes around 4/5. It's pretty loud and I use overdrive pedals to boost it a bit.
Will this be dangerous for my speakers, or should they handle it easy?

Is there a way to measure the output of the amp at several settings?

I just love those Greenbacks and don't want to carry around a 4x12 cab. Selling the 2466 and buying the 2266 is not an option, because the second hand market over here in Holland is almost dead...... :nope

Thanks for your input.

[surfnorthwest]

:angryexplode
just a matter of time before you blow those speakers. You need at least four 25 watt greenbacks for your 100 watt head.

[burnsy]

I agree with Mr.NorthWest.
Even a 50w head could 'peak' and take those speakers out.

[guitarguru]

I agree with Mr.NorthWest.
Even a 50w head could 'peak' and take those speakers out.

Mmmmm............. Last friday I played like this with no problems though.
Wish someone could tell me the output power on some settings, to stay at the right side.

[ironlung40]

I think knowing the output ratings at certain settings would not help you any. It is a fact that you're running speakers not rated to handle the power you're pushing through them. They will burn up, it is just a question of when it will happen. Do your self a favor and get a properly rated config. before you waste those speakers. V30's sound good with the VM and you could run 2 of those in your 2x12 cab for a 120watt rating. I do this with my 2466 and haven't had a problem. I don't have a solution if you're wanting to keep running the speakers you have now. Perhaps a 4x12 with em' if you had a 2266.

good luck to you

[guitarguru]

I think knowing the output ratings at certain settings would not help you any. It is a fact that you're running speakers not rated to handle the power you're pushing through them. They will burn up, it is just a question of when it will happen. Do your self a favor and get a properly rated config. before you waste those speakers. V30's sound good with the VM and you could run 2 of those in your 2x12 cab for a 120watt rating. I do this with my 2466 and haven't had a problem. I don't have a solution if you're wanting to keep running the speakers you have now. Perhaps a 4x12 with em' if you had a 2266.

good luck to you

That's a pity........... I love the sound of those Greenbacks. And sorry, I hate the sound of the VM with Vintage 30's, so fizzy and shrill, and too damned loud too.

I'll think this whole thing over and decide later... Perhaps two G12-65's will do the trick.

[ClubAndCountry]

If you love them, love the amp, love the tone, and can't easily trade the amp for a 2266, the solution is simple - get an attenuator. If you knock off 3dB that's equivalent to halving the power of the amp - probably just about enough to get you into the safe range, since the 2466 isn't really a full 100W amp - and if you take off 4dB or more, almost certainly safe. Celestions are rated very conservatively compared to most speakers. (But not conservatively enough for what you're doing now!)

You can either do it the conventional way with the attenuator between the amp and speaker, or if you think that will affect the tone too much (which in my opinion it doesn't) you can run the attenuator as a dummy speaker cab, in parallel with the real one, and which will absorb half the amp's power. (Remember to set the amp to half the impedance of the the cab and attenuator.)

If you're in Holland, I'd recommend the Koch Loadbox, which is a well-made attenuator with a useful set of functions including a perfect - for your needs - 40%-level output, and should be easy to find!

http://www.koch-amps.com/koch/index.php ... &Itemid=20

[bluesbrother]

+1 On the koch loadbox II.

I use it with the the 2266 , it is very transparent and does not affect
your tone.
100 watt with the MV on 5 with a 40 watt cab is just a matter of time....
In most cases the amp get hurt real bad too because there is no load if
the speakers blow .... :scared

[guitarguru]

Choices, choices......

1. attenuator on same amp/speakers. (quite expensive)
2. get a 4x12 cab with greenbacks. (too heavy/big)
3. try G12-65's and I'm safe. (might or might not like the sound)
4. buy a second cab with M20's. (2 cabs to carry around)
5. pulling 2 tubes was not an option on the VM? (still a risk at 50 watt)
6. try swapping the 2466 for a 2266. (still a risk at 50 watt)
7. try another amp, for example a JTM45. (still have to get rid of the 2466)

I'll search first for two 2nd hand G12-65's. Can always sell them for same price.

[surfnorthwest]

Go with option #3

[ClubAndCountry]

Or look for a second hand Load Box... which you may be more likely to find than a pair of 65s.

I love G12-65s, they're some of my favourite speakers ever, and of the modern high-power Celestions they're certainly the closest to G12M-25s, but they still don't sound the same. In particular, if you like that overdriven-speaker cone-breakup sound from the G12Ms, they don't do that, they're much tighter and smoother when pushed.

Or even if the second hand market is dead, you could try advertising for a straight swap of your amp for a 2266 - for someone who has bought one and is finding it not quite loud enough, that would be a value upgrade and they would probably be very happy to do it! But a 2266 isn't going to sound quite the same as an attenuated 2466 either...

I would think that a 2266 on a 40W Celestion cab is probably safe enough - it's not really a 50W amp, and not even quite 40W. The one I tested only measured about 36W if I remember right.

[ironlung40]

I think knowing the output ratings at certain settings would not help you any. It is a fact that you're running speakers not rated to handle the power you're pushing through them. They will burn up, it is just a question of when it will happen. Do your self a favor and get a properly rated config. before you waste those speakers. V30's sound good with the VM and you could run 2 of those in your 2x12 cab for a 120watt rating. I do this with my 2466 and haven't had a problem. I don't have a solution if you're wanting to keep running the speakers you have now. Perhaps a 4x12 with em' if you had a 2266.

good luck to you

That's a pity........... I love the sound of those Greenbacks. And sorry, I hate the sound of the VM with Vintage 30's, so fizzy and shrill, and too damned loud too.

I'll think this whole thing over and decide later... Perhaps two G12-65's will do the trick.

Hey, I hear you on not liking the V30's with this amp. Not everyone does. I've got celestion 65's also. Mine are original and I've used them in my 2x12 with the VM before and I liked them a lot better than the V30's. I also play several other heads with my 2x12 though and the V30's at the moment seem to be the best option I have to be flexible with all of them. I don't want to change em' in and out. I'll get another cab at some point. Anyway, I think you'd like the 65's. Are you going for old ones, or do are they in production still?

as for the load boxes, I never liked them. I always thought the tone suffered heavily. That's why I just play master volumes. I think the speakers would be your best bet to get what you want.

[guitarguru]

I think knowing the output ratings at certain settings would not help you any. It is a fact that you're running speakers not rated to handle the power you're pushing through them. They will burn up, it is just a question of when it will happen. Do your self a favor and get a properly rated config. before you waste those speakers. V30's sound good with the VM and you could run 2 of those in your 2x12 cab for a 120watt rating. I do this with my 2466 and haven't had a problem. I don't have a solution if you're wanting to keep running the speakers you have now. Perhaps a 4x12 with em' if you had a 2266.

good luck to you

That's a pity........... I love the sound of those Greenbacks. And sorry, I hate the sound of the VM with Vintage 30's, so fizzy and shrill, and too damned loud too.

I'll think this whole thing over and decide later... Perhaps two G12-65's will do the trick.

Hey, I hear you on not liking the V30's with this amp. Not everyone does. I've got celestion 65's also. Mine are original and I've used them in my 2x12 with the VM before and I liked them a lot better than the V30's. I also play several other heads with my 2x12 though and the V30's at the moment seem to be the best option I have to be flexible with all of them. I don't want to change em' in and out. I'll get another cab at some point. Anyway, I think you'd like the 65's. Are you going for old ones, or do are they in production still?

as for the load boxes, I never liked them. I always thought the tone suffered heavily. That's why I just play master volumes. I think the speakers would be your best bet to get what you want.

The 65's are still/again in production by Celestion. They're part of the Heritage Collection. Can't find them though, used...........

[ironlung40]

I think knowing the output ratings at certain settings would not help you any. It is a fact that you're running speakers not rated to handle the power you're pushing through them. They will burn up, it is just a question of when it will happen. Do your self a favor and get a properly rated config. before you waste those speakers. V30's sound good with the VM and you could run 2 of those in your 2x12 cab for a 120watt rating. I do this with my 2466 and haven't had a problem. I don't have a solution if you're wanting to keep running the speakers you have now. Perhaps a 4x12 with em' if you had a 2266.

good luck to you

That's a pity........... I love the sound of those Greenbacks. And sorry, I hate the sound of the VM with Vintage 30's, so fizzy and shrill, and too damned loud too.

I'll think this whole thing over and decide later... Perhaps two G12-65's will do the trick.

Hey, I hear you on not liking the V30's with this amp. Not everyone does. I've got celestion 65's also. Mine are original and I've used them in my 2x12 with the VM before and I liked them a lot better than the V30's. I also play several other heads with my 2x12 though and the V30's at the moment seem to be the best option I have to be flexible with all of them. I don't want to change em' in and out. I'll get another cab at some point. Anyway, I think you'd like the 65's. Are you going for old ones, or do are they in production still?

as for the load boxes, I never liked them. I always thought the tone suffered heavily. That's why I just play master volumes. I think the speakers would be your best bet to get what you want.

The 65's are still/again in production by Celestion. They're part of the Heritage Collection. Can't find them though, used...........

I've seen them used from time to time, but at high prices. The best way to get them used would be to buy an old cabinet already loaded with them. I saw a cabinet about a year ago for sale with them in it. It was a JCM 800 series cab. I believe the price was only about 400 dollars. I should've bought it, but didn't need it. Anyway, at the per price for speaker, buying a cab already loaded seems to always be the better buy.

[Orbis_Mortis]

I kind of have the same problem. I am running a mesa 3/4 closed back with one V30 with my 2466, which is only 60 watts. I love the V30 sounds.

So will an attenuator solve my problem as well? Especially since I don't gig at the moment.